Whats your opinions on makeing videos?

[itbeme]

Hiya i was just wondering what your opinion was on makeing videos, as parkour isnt about showing off it seems odd that we make videos, i have made one video like ages back and its pretty much just vaults, but anyway i was thinking about a new video just so i can like track my training in some way. would this be for the wrong reasons? thanks. =D

[Dave]

Yes, I also think it's odd how so many videos get produced.

I think there are plenty of useful things you can do with parkour videos, like recording ability your levels to help track your progress, sharing training ideas with others, asking for advice from distant practitioners, and helping people learn about parkour. There might be others, so If you think it's going to be useful then do it

It's a bit pointless sharing videos that aren't going to help others though. When you can't see what's going on because of the lens or camera angle or editing, or when it's just the same movements in the same places with different music, it gets a bit daft.

[Mafio]

Video is not about showing off I think. But more just to share your vaults and your progress. For people like me videos give me a lot of motivation, thats main reason why i am watching them.

[Dave]

Sharing information is fine.

Trying to impress people with fancy music/editing/angles/lenses not so much.

[cupofcoldtea]

i agree with dave ^-^

[gregg]

It's not odd how much video is out there. Most digital cameras can take video, and even some cell phones. Most PCs have MovieMaker on them.

Dave's already hit some good reasons for shooting video. A couple others would be
- tutorials [teaching moves],
- inspiration [have you seen Oleg's "Out of Time" vid? http://vimeo.com/6495648 ],
- checking your flow [Stutters? Junk landing? Ok... got to work on those]

Other reasons...
- sharing experiences [Jams, classes, APEX "Ninja Warrior" night, etc]
- just for fun... entertainment or artistic

To me, working in front of the camera's like being in front of people. If I show off and push my limits, I often get hurt.
As a challenge, I try editing any video I shoot to 1 minute. It forces me to focus on what's really important.

[Dave]

I include inspiration in the 'helping people learn' category. I'm not sure there is another useful way to help people learn, other than to inspire them to act themselves. I did forget to mention visual self-assessment though.

Beyond helping make people aware of the options that exist for movement there isn't really any useful purpose served by movement tutorial videos. Knowing movement techniques is useless on its own. It's the learning process that is the most important bit, as that's the part where you learn how to learn.
Skipping stages is counter-productive. Copying others is a bad habit to get into.

Sharing experiences via video can be useful, but the experience of watching the video will always be different to the experience of being part of the events being shown. Living in the real world is more enjoyable and more useful than re-living second-hand experiences, so I prefer to encourage people to have real experiences.
Same goes for making videos for fun. There are plenty of things you can do for fun, why not do the things that are also useful in other ways?

[gregg]

99% of my training has been by myself. Some times there's one idea in a tutorial video that opens up new possibilities for me. Even if I'm not trying to learn THAT technique. A good tutorial also shows common mistakes, and how to avoid or minimize them, saving possible injury.

Copying others is how we learn to walk, dance, play musical instruments, function socially, etc. Painters spend time trying to copy the masters to understand color choices, stroke and brush techniques, etc. It's all part of progression.

After you've got some basics, then you learn to combine, improvise, create something new. It's usually crude, and easy to spot the influences, but it's a start. Then you learn something else, and try again...

I agree with you that it's better to live in the real world, and have real experiences. That's why you and I spend so much time on the forums, right? >:D

[Dave]

Copying others is what we do before we learn how to think for ourselves about something. When we don't have our own ideas and are unable to make our own decisions we fall back on those of others, but when we do have our own ideas they always take precedence.
Copying is the important first stage of learning, but the more advanced stage where you generate your own ideas is a fundamentally different approach so you don't want to get too used to acting like a beginner.

Making mistakes yourself is an absolutely essential part of learning. There is no way you can get through life doing important things without making mistakes, copying others or otherwise, and you need to be able to deal with it.
The way to learn the most from mistakes is to make them yourself. Make them early in the process, during the basic stages, and you develop independence while the negative consequences are minor. Use more help than you absolutely need during the early stages and you end up having to learn these important lessons from the far more dangerous later stages. Or never learning them, which I think is worse.

As long as you don't try and see things that aren't there in online discussions then they are just as real as a brick wall. There aren't many more useful ways to spend a few hours a week than testing ideas and practising communication skills.

[gregg]

Do I understand you right:

1: "Video is good if it's useful." [for yourself or others]
2: "Things that are not useful are not good." [fancy editing, repetition due to lack of creativity]

3: "Tutorial videos are not useful, except for awareness of movement options."
4: "The learning process is more important than knowing movement techniques."
5: "Copying others is for beginners. As we progress we make our own ideas."
6: "You need to learn by making mistakes while the consequences are small."

Let me know if I'm missing any points, or have anything wrong.

[Dave]

You've got those 6 points right. Each sentence I write makes at least one point though, so short of typing everything out again you're always going to miss some of them.

[Omer]

99% of my training has been by myself. Some times there's one idea in a tutorial video that opens up new possibilities for me. Even if I'm not trying to learn THAT technique. A good tutorial also shows common mistakes, and how to avoid or minimize them, saving possible injury.

Copying others is how we learn to walk, dance, play musical instruments, function socially, etc. Painters spend time trying to copy the masters to understand color choices, stroke and brush techniques, etc. It's all part of progression.

After you've got some basics, then you learn to combine, improvise, create something new. It's usually crude, and easy to spot the influences, but it's a start. Then you learn something else, and try again...

I agree with you that it's better to live in the real world, and have real experiences. That's why you and I spend so much time on the forums, right? >:D

I have to agree with that. just starting in parkour but I have learned a lot for strength training from just watching experts do their thing and show off. The change of angles is always a bit irritating and it's a common camera trick in films (that's why I love Tony Jaa's movies) but a lot of physical stuff is mental incentive too. I was surprised by how much technique goes into one arm chin ups and such, it looks like it's pure muscular strength but the coordination is pretty intense and watching others achieve goals like that helps you feel motivated even if it is just some 5 year old romanian kid showing off for the camera

[gregg]

Just trying to summarize what I thought were your main points, Dave

[playhater]

Make videos using fish eye lenses to make yourself look cool, also put an R & B / hip-hop / dubstep track in for the added wow factor, throw in a few effects using sony vegas, and that's a video

[NathNinetyOne]

Dont forget to add an air dash or three.

[gregg]

@ Playhater: I haven't been doing any of those things. Maybe that's why my videos are junk?!

[Kieronk]

I make videos because i enjoy the process of filming, editing, and finding good music that i love to use. Its also a nice memory of the events that happened that day or whenever.

[Kieronk]

Trying to impress people with fancy music/editing/angles/lenses not so much.

if you're gonna make a video you might as well make it as good as you can in these areas...Why purposefully put less effort in on angles and equipment and music just to make your video shit?

[Dave]

Using fancy music/editing/angles/lenses only makes a video better if your goal is to impress people (which only perpetuates mental weaknesses). If your goal is to help people strengthen in all respects (i.e. parkour) then removing those things makes it better.

Recording events is fine, but then if you add effects you're no longer presenting the events as they happened but creating a fantasy.

[Kieronk]

no, it makes a video better because the video quality is better, the lighting is better, the shots are better... Not to impress people, its just simply better as a video piece